Any testers still alive here?

[Ostricide]

its like a ghost forum around here. 

I have a small map I hope will be fun to play on.  My initial tests with bots indicate good action and plenty of sniping and camping.

I have not spent a lot of time making this map pretty as my focus was on playability.  its blocky and bland looking.

I have a .pk3 and the original .bsp and .aas files if needed.  There are no original textures, models or scripts.

so if anyone is alive that cares, please send me feedback.

UPDATE:  thanks RonaldLee for fixing the .pk3 file, see below for details.


oh BTW, if any one who knows about such things cares to look, there is a glitch I cannot track down which causes HOM artifacting.  In the blue spawn area, when I add the same features as are in the red spawn area, if you look at the ramp leading to the snipers loft you'll note the HOM effect in the openings to the loft.  there is a history to this glitch that started when i made the ramp and cut into the platform leaving a super thin slice of brush.  I found it and removed it and thought the problem was solved but now it has returned.  I am at a loss as to why.  TIA for your time and patience.

TIA.

UPDATE:  ut4_dogleg-a2 should work now.  I hope its fun to play.


*****If your new to testing maps :

copy the .pk3 to your urbanterror\q3ut4 folder and run urban terror... use ~ to get a console prompt and type /map ut4_dogleg-a2

*****

Update:  -b11 is the latest, hopefully playable release.  and I'm removing all the alpha releases I posted here.

[SnKQuaKe]

Map wont load on my system. Can someone else confirm this? Flame?

[Ostricide]

Map wont load on my system. Can someone else confirm this? Flame?

wow.. sorry for the hassle quake... uh I have been using /devmap to playtest it actually.  The ver I posted is a final build and it was my understanding that when i put .pk3 on the zip file that UrT would know what to do.  I must be wrong...  i'm researching that now, unless someone can tell me right off thier heads what i'm missing.

again sorry for the problem and thanks for your patience ... I am activly working on the map and its issues.

Thanks.

[RonaldLee[1up]]

Here is a fixed version of your map.

You did not pack it properly because you included the "maps" folder inside another folder which was then inside the .pk3.

Take a .zip file then add the maps folder to it, then rename the .zip extension to .pk3.
That is all you need to do to pack the basic stuff.

As a courtesy I repacked your map and files and renamed everything to "dogleg_a1"

/devmap dogleg_a1 works just fine now.

[RonaldLee[1up]]

I also meant to add that if you are trying to clip that map for bots, you will have a lot of work to go through. For example, you may have made an .aas file but you have no entities to direct or attract bots, such as the bot_roam entities. I wonder if you are using bot_clip in your .map file. Bots will get stuck on certain objects.

I looked over your entities republished below to see if you had employed any bot_roam, which it is not there:

"classname" "worldspawn"
}
{
"classname" "info_player_deathmatch"
"origin" "864 -864 496"
"angle" "135"
}
{
"classname" "info_player_deathmatch"
"origin" "420 -556 488"
"angle" "90.8863"
}
{
"classname" "info_player_deathmatch"
"origin" "-1856 896 664"
"angle" "-46.8183"
}
{
"classname" "info_player_deathmatch"
"origin" "-1472 576 488"
"angle" "-89.6808"
}
{
"classname" "info_player_deathmatch"
"origin" "924 36 288"
"angle" "139.315"
}
{
"classname" "info_player_deathmatch"
"origin" "-1952 -32 288"
"angle" "-35.4352"
}
{
"classname" "info_player_deathmatch"
"origin" "456 296 40"
"angle" "139.315"
}
{
"classname" "info_player_deathmatch"
"origin" "0 284 40"
"angle" "100.94"
}
{
"classname" "info_player_deathmatch"
"origin" "-480 740 40"
"angle" "-106.179"
}
{
"classname" "info_player_deathmatch"
"origin" "-752 152 40"
"angle" "8.15183"
}
{
"classname" "info_player_deathmatch"
"origin" "-748 -168 40"
"angle" "-43.763"
}
{
"classname" "info_player_deathmatch"
"origin" "-312 -484 40"
"angle" "139.315"
}
{
"classname" "info_player_deathmatch"
"origin" "-1020 -756 40"
"angle" "113.082"
}
{
"classname" "info_player_deathmatch"
"origin" "-1492 -708 40"
"angle" "48.9698"
}
{
"classname" "info_player_deathmatch"
"origin" "-1300 -932 288"
"angle" "79.3848"
}
{
"classname" "info_player_deathmatch"
"origin" "-416 800 288"
"angle" "173.558"
}
{
"classname" "info_player_deathmatch"
"origin" "476 944 288"
"angle" "-35.4352"
}
{
"classname" "team_CTF_blueplayer"
"origin" "840 -928 488"
"angle" "-177.735"
}
{
"classname" "team_CTF_bluespawn"
"origin" "828 -964 488"
"angle" "-174.288"
}
{
"classname" "team_CTF_blueplayer"
"origin" "944 -780 488"
"angle" "-177.735"
}
{
"classname" "team_CTF_bluespawn"
"origin" "932 -816 488"
"angle" "-174.288"
}
{
"classname" "team_CTF_blueplayer"
"origin" "960 -652 488"
"angle" "-177.735"
}
{
"classname" "team_CTF_bluespawn"
"origin" "948 -688 488"
"angle" "-174.288"
}
{
"classname" "team_CTF_blueplayer"
"origin" "960 -536 488"
"angle" "-177.735"
}
{
"classname" "team_CTF_bluespawn"
"origin" "948 -572 488"
"angle" "-174.288"
}
{
"classname" "team_CTF_blueplayer"
"origin" "956 -412 488"
"angle" "-177.735"
}
{
"classname" "team_CTF_bluespawn"
"origin" "944 -448 488"
"angle" "-174.288"
}
{
"classname" "team_CTF_blueplayer"
"origin" "816 -704 488"
"angle" "-177.735"
}
{
"classname" "team_CTF_bluespawn"
"origin" "804 -740 488"
"angle" "-174.288"
}
{
"classname" "team_CTF_blueplayer"
"origin" "828 -572 488"
"angle" "-177.735"
}
{
"classname" "team_CTF_bluespawn"
"origin" "816 -608 488"
"angle" "-174.288"
}
{
"classname" "team_CTF_blueplayer"
"origin" "820 -424 488"
"angle" "-177.735"
}
{
"classname" "team_CTF_bluespawn"
"origin" "808 -460 488"
"angle" "-174.288"
}
{
"classname" "team_CTF_blueplayer"
"origin" "720 -836 488"
"angle" "-177.735"
}
{
"classname" "team_CTF_bluespawn"
"origin" "708 -872 488"
"angle" "-174.288"
}
{
"classname" "team_CTF_blueplayer"
"origin" "684 -716 488"
"angle" "-177.735"
}
{
"classname" "team_CTF_bluespawn"
"origin" "672 -752 488"
"angle" "-174.288"
}
{
"classname" "team_CTF_blueplayer"
"origin" "716 -572 488"
"angle" "-177.735"
}
{
"classname" "team_CTF_bluespawn"
"origin" "704 -608 488"
"angle" "-174.288"
}
{
"classname" "team_CTF_blueplayer"
"origin" "676 -404 488"
"angle" "-177.735"
}
{
"classname" "team_CTF_bluespawn"
"origin" "664 -440 488"
"angle" "-174.288"
}
{
"classname" "team_CTF_blueplayer"
"origin" "600 -612 488"
"angle" "-177.735"
}
{
"classname" "team_CTF_bluespawn"
"origin" "588 -648 488"
"angle" "-174.288"
}
{
"classname" "team_CTF_blueplayer"
"origin" "600 -924 488"
"angle" "-177.735"
}
{
"classname" "team_CTF_bluespawn"
"origin" "588 -960 488"
"angle" "-174.288"
}
{
"classname" "team_CTF_blueplayer"
"origin" "584 -800 488"
"angle" "-177.735"
}
{
"classname" "team_CTF_bluespawn"
"origin" "572 -836 488"
"angle" "-174.288"
}
{
"classname" "team_CTF_blueplayer"
"origin" "816 -828 488"
"angle" "-177.735"
}
{
"classname" "team_CTF_bluespawn"
"origin" "804 -864 488"
"angle" "-174.288"
}
{
"classname" "team_CTF_redplayer"
"origin" "-1876 812 668"
}
{
"classname" "team_CTF_redspawn"
"origin" "-1876 776 668"
}
{
"classname" "team_CTF_redplayer"
"origin" "-1876 692 668"
}
{
"classname" "team_CTF_redspawn"
"origin" "-1876 656 668"
}
{
"classname" "team_CTF_redplayer"
"origin" "-1672 908 668"
"angle" "-90"
}
{
"classname" "team_CTF_redspawn"
"origin" "-1708 908 668"
"angle" "-90"
}
{
"classname" "team_CTF_redplayer"
"origin" "-1740 884 668"
"angle" "-90"
}
{
"classname" "team_CTF_redspawn"
"origin" "-1776 884 668"
"angle" "-90"
}
{
"classname" "team_CTF_redplayer"
"origin" "-1840 752 668"
}
{
"classname" "team_CTF_redspawn"
"origin" "-1840 716 668"
}
{
"classname" "team_CTF_redplayer"
"origin" "-1580 660 784"
"angle" "180"
}
{
"classname" "team_CTF_redspawn"
"origin" "-1580 696 784"
"angle" "180"
}
{
"classname" "team_CTF_redplayer"
"origin" "-1580 780 784"
"angle" "180"
}
{
"classname" "team_CTF_redspawn"
"origin" "-1580 816 784"
"angle" "180"
}
{
"classname" "team_CTF_redplayer"
"origin" "-1784 564 784"
"angle" "90"
}
{
"classname" "team_CTF_redspawn"
"origin" "-1748 564 784"
"angle" "90"
}
{
"classname" "team_CTF_redplayer"
"origin" "-1716 588 784"
"angle" "90"
}
{
"classname" "team_CTF_redspawn"
"origin" "-1680 588 784"
"angle" "90"
}
{
"classname" "team_CTF_redplayer"
"origin" "-1616 720 784"
"angle" "180"
}
{
"classname" "team_CTF_redspawn"
"origin" "-1616 756 784"
"angle" "180"
}
{
"classname" "team_CTF_redplayer"
"origin" "-1868 812 492"
}
{
"classname" "team_CTF_redspawn"
"origin" "-1868 776 492"
}
{
"classname" "team_CTF_redplayer"
"origin" "-1868 692 492"
}
{
"classname" "team_CTF_redspawn"
"origin" "-1868 656 492"
}
{
"classname" "team_CTF_redplayer"
"origin" "-1960 840 492"
"angle" "-90"
}
{
"classname" "team_CTF_redspawn"
"origin" "-1996 840 492"
"angle" "-90"
}
{
"classname" "team_CTF_redplayer"
"origin" "-1700 892 492"
"angle" "-90"
}
{
"classname" "team_CTF_redspawn"
"origin" "-1736 892 492"
"angle" "-90"
}
{
"classname" "team_CTF_redplayer"
"origin" "-1832 752 492"
}
{
"classname" "team_CTF_redspawn"
"origin" "-1832 716 492"
}
{
"classname" "team_CTF_redflag"
"origin" "-1588 520 624"
}
{
"classname" "team_CTF_blueflag"
"origin" "916 -940 480"
"angle" "-90"
}

[Ostricide]

RonaldLee that is awesome... thanks for the fix and the explanation.... there was a minor hiccup when i packe3d the zip but i thought it had worked.  again good looking, thanks. 

I have not applied any bot stuff or caulk or anything like that yet.  this is my first attempt at a serious map and i know i have a lot to learn and do before this will get into a rotation anywhere. keep the critizisms coming, i can take it all.

I am looking over your last post and  I guess I was hoping there would be enough action in a small space to avoid bot loitering... still I will look over the results of bspc and look over the map closely see if I can find some good spots for the bot entities.  

I will download the botpacks posted elsewhere in this forum and see what kind of results I get after adding the bot entities

thanks to all for helping.

[RonaldLee[1up]]

RonaldLee that is awesome... thanks for the fix and the explanation.... there was a minor hiccup when i packe3d the zip but i thought it had worked.  again good looking, thanks. 

I have not applied any bot stuff or caulk or anything like that yet.  this is my first attempt at a serious map and i know i have a lot to learn and do before this will get into a rotation anywhere. keep the critizisms coming, i can take it all.  I am looking over your last post and trying to understand it...   I'm getting there, just wanna see my map played if its worthy.

thanks to all for helping.

I was not criticizing you. I apologize if the message I conveyed to you was construed as criticism.
Please keep in mind that in urt4.1 the bot code is all screwed up, but could have been fixed quite easily in a matter of a few days work. The dev team concentrates on larger issues and will probably never fix it. This means you must first understand the limitations of bots. I would point you to be very careful in using func_walls because bots believe the func_walls to remain even when they do not in certain gametypes. This is another example of a very simple fix that the dev team could have accomplished in less than 15 minutes to make bot movement work in CTF mode for maps like ut4_algiers.

[SnKQuaKe]

I just would get an error while the map was loading I unpacked the bsp from the pk3 and dropped it in maps folder. Anyways thats all the time i had to devote to trying it. Not back int he swing of things yet.

[Ostricide]

Okay, followed that link.  what a great bit of information to have.  thanks again.  I am working on the bot stuff now and should have an -a2 available by the end of the day. 

I didn't think you were criticizing ME... just the .pk3 I posted (I should probably remove that!) which needed criticizing to work right... no prob, i'm just saying anything you think would be an improvement is appreciated.

off to bot path. 

Quake, thanks for bein the first GuinnePig to squeal  

[Ostricide]

ut_dogleg-a2.pk3 is a HUGE improvement over -a1... here is what I have done :

1. covered the bridges... a simple thing but a great improvement.
2. relocated the spawn points and added a couple bot_wander's and campsites just in case.
3. applied the hybrid sunset sky texture... that makes the map easier to look at.
4. added a couple brushes to eliminate spawn sniping from across the map.

things to do:

1. the lights need attention.
2. add a few cuts to the base of each flagroom to add to playability.
3. add bot-wanders to the lowest level.
4. change / add boxes to increase playability.
5. fix any glitches that are discovered during playtesting.
6. add bot info for capture the flag (right now they won't try anything).


I have run many tests with 8bot.cfg and clanbot.cfg and it is rare for the TDM score spread to exceed 5 points and there is action all over the map during FFA and TDM.  I think this map is at least as fun as bottle or battlefield.


Maybe I could talk the admin into giving me a few hours rotation time somewhere   you know, just to generate some feedback.

as always lemme know if there are any problems or if you have ANY suggestions / complaints or whatever.

TIA for your time.

[Ostricide]

I have been working on Dogleg all week and I think I have a good beta build that is really ready for playtesting.

the pk3 will now list the map in your servers maplist so you can just fire up and play.

ANY feedback would be appreciated.  I guess if I hear nothing then I'll assume its not worth pursuing any further.

Thanks, enjoy.

ManiacalMoose


UPDATE!  AARRGGGG!  this is ver b11 which is a final build instead of a test build.  my bad, sorry.  thanks to neeko for pointing out the black areas in the -b1 ver.  again sorry for the constant updates.

[neeko]

ManiacalMoose: It has a lot of potential. I like all the shadow and the corridors yet there's a large open cross-area for sniping and the like.

The pain brush on the water I'm not sure about. You don't see that in many maps (any?). There could be a reason. Without playing it with people I don't really know. I like the idea of having that area open and usable at a penalty to your health. How did you decide to make the water shallow enough not to swim in? Just curious. And did you write the water shader?

I would suggest setting a small amount of ambient light in your worldspawn just to remove the pitch black surfaces. I know using the ambient key is frowned upon but you could at least use it while you're working on the map. If you do a full-max-high-quality-light compile with bouncing that might take care of the pitch black for you.

Some time on a server for play testing would be grand. I'd be there.

[Ostricide]

ManiacalMoose: It has a lot of potential. I like all the shadow and the corridors yet there's a large open cross-area for sniping and the like.

neeko, thanks for lookin at my map!

The pain brush on the water I'm not sure about. You don't see that in many maps (any?). There could be a reason. Without playing it with people I don't really know. I like the idea of having that area open and usable at a penalty to your health. How did you decide to make the water shallow enough not to swim in? Just curious. And did you write the water shader?

Yeah, this did not turn out like I had imagined, but the spirit is there.  The map I was thinkin about when i put it in was Battlefield.  problem with most pain liquids (imho) is that your stuck once you get in.  I guess my idea was that if you were not careful you'd give away your posistion and take damage but not die without a chance.  I actually hadn't thought about making the water deep enough to swim in... i kinda like the idea though   and, no, I wouldn't have the slightest idea how to make a shader and if I am using them its transparent to me.  I have seen them mentioned but so far as long as it works I havn't investigated unless I had to.

I would suggest setting a small amount of ambient light in your worldspawn just to remove the pitch black surfaces. I know using the ambient key is frowned upon but you could at least use it while you're working on the map. If you do a full-max-high-quality-light compile with bouncing that might take care of the pitch black for you.

Until I read this it didn't occure to me that I had done a test build to make the last .bsp so you are absolutely right.... I'll have to fix that first and possibly repost (I hate that!)  Also I need to do some more work on the lights and I will take all the suggestions you can come up with... I'll mess with the ambient and see what happens.  I think it might be dark and open enough to benifit.

Some time on a server for play testing would be grand. I'd be there.

I like your review... its got good points and ideas... I need more of them!  keep it coming.

[neeko]

Re: the water, maybe not even deep enough to swim in. Getting stuck in pain liquids is a bummer like you said, or falling in and being 3ft+ under is... ow. Maybe just deep enough to effect your movement? In urban combat 2 (posted here) there's an underground sewer-ish route and I used both swimable water and very shallow water the way you're using yours here (to set off the 'splash' alarm ). My thinking was that entirely swimable would have been frustrating to fall in but all shallow would've seemed flat.

You've got the right idea not worrying too much about lighting yet. I just suggested using ambient because it's a cheap and fast way to take the edge off the shadows while you focus on more integral aspects of the map.

[neeko]

b11: lookin' good man.

I have a hard time seeing the forest for the trees. Great job emphasizing the overall layout before you get hung up on the details. It's not a flat-map and it isn't an Abbey/Uptown knock-off. Might make it a hard sell... but I like it

If there's anything I could do to get this map some action on a server somewhere I'd be willing to help out.